"people look up to doctors as authorities and the State gives them protected status as authorities on medicine." well, California is certainly taking that away and anyone who still has trust in the medical system at this point might be an irredeemable fool.
"Did you notice he used ad hominem and arguments of authority" maybe i'll fi…
"people look up to doctors as authorities and the State gives them protected status as authorities on medicine." well, California is certainly taking that away and anyone who still has trust in the medical system at this point might be an irredeemable fool.
"Did you notice he used ad hominem and arguments of authority" maybe i'll find it and listen to it again.
"I think doctors like ZDogg do influence people, that is one reason they get paid." but doctors like ZDogg have had their podcasts for a long time; it's not like they cropped up just to act as propaganda arms for the US government's public health policy. they've had podcasts on various topics and had on guests that you may have found interesting. and they don't "get paid." they are paid by their listeners, some who find them interesting and entertaining enough to subscribe to get more than what is offered for free (i'm too cheap). both ZDogg and Prasad have been in the medical field for years and i'm sure that they took vaccines for granted. now if it turns out that they got funds from the government to sneak certain messages into their podcasts, as i'd bet TWIV did, that would be unforgivable and in that case, even an apology wouldn't do it for me.
i have no real problem with someone saying "i think everyone in a certain risk category should get vaccinated" as long as that's what they believed and they weren't getting paid to say it. and i have no problem with them, later as they saw more things, wondering "WTF is going on with these vaccines?" i don't think that's hypocrisy or demands a mea culpa.
i DO have a problem with a guy like Piers Morgan saying "strip them of their rights, imprison them, forcibly vaccinate them" and then later, realizing that there might be a price to pay for such behavior, trying to justify it- "well, with the information i had at the time..." and "the science has changed." that's bullshit and no apology is sufficient. this guy revealed himself as a dark soul. he would have been first in line to load jews onto boxcars. who would ever listen to him again?
"sign of illogical reasoning"
the greatest example of illogical reasoning i ever heard was on TWIV. one week they would interview peter daszak who talked about how oh so easy it was to manipulate a virus and the next week, someone would ask about the lab leak possibility and they would say "oh human beings aren't smart enough to make anything as clever as sars cv-2. i'd think huh? trust me, they're still talking about natural origin.
"I love Peter Atia BTW."
i especially loved it when Atia came around to the lab leak hypothesis in his interview with katherine eban. (do you remember Atia saying that the vaccines were great and so effective that you shouldn't have any cancer screenings after getting them? do you remember him later on saying that he would not get his children vaccinated and he moved his family to texas? but i have yet to hear him apologize for saying that the vaccines were great. i wonder if he's having a bit of buyer's remorse. he took a position- for himself- based on his medical training and later on, he saw that something was fishy and adjusted accordingly).
i am especially disappointed in eric topol. that's who i can't forgive. in his podcast with atia, he talked about how he was tortured, fired, threatened (by MERCK) after pointing out the safety signal for VIOXX. atia thought it was a good drug that was unjustly taken off the market but topol made him see it differently since he had lived through it.
then i heard that very same topol (who i respected and bought his book) accusing bret weinstein of spreading "dangerous misinformation" that is "killing people" with that insufferable and unbearable sam harris.
as if death threats only matter when they happen to you, dr. topol but they're fine for everyone else, provided you don't like them.
then harris said on triggernometry that it didn't matter if hunter biden's laptop contained photos of dead children in the basement, it needed to be kept hidden because keeping trump out of office justified anything!!! YIKES!!!!!
i expect ZDogg might admit that he got some things wrong one of these days and it's ok to be wrong as long as you didn't threaten to fire or kill people who didn't think you were right. but there's something oddly communist about making people recant their past sins. as for topol and harris, they can apologize till the cows come home. they're dead to me. which doesn't mean that they might not say something intelligent that i can agree with one of these days. but as examples of humanity, no way.
"maintain critical thinking skills"
i still think people have to take some responsibility. just as i can't respect women who blame the "patriarchy," BLM blaming systemic racism or ancestral slavery or any of the other career victims blaming someone or something else for their failures, i can't blame guys like ZDogg and Prasad who i didn't hear pressure anyone to do anything. now, like i said, i haven't heard much ZDogg and i mostly read Prasad so maybe they did urge people to get vaccinated. i would expect them to do that, steeped as they are in conventional medicine (much like aseem malhotra who never questioned vaccines in general and covid vaccines specifically until his father died. we're not going to ask him to apologize, are we? isn't losing his father enough? do we really want to call him a shill for the drug companies- even though he did urge people to get vaccinated- when he's probably getting plenty of heat from those same companies and his wikipedia page will be rewritten to tar him as a "spreader of dangerous misinformation" and he's certainly jeopardized his career?) but there's a big difference between urging without teeth and coercive urging at gunpoint. whatever you think, they're just talking. a lot of people tried to blame joe rogan for all vaccine hesitancy but really, he's just a guy talking. and he was 9 when i decided against flu shots so i don't think he had that much to do with it.
we all listened to biden warn us about the winter of severe illness and death. some of us marched right out and got vaccinated. some of us threw our shoes at the television set. some of us (me) used it as a christmas card. ZDogg can give his opinion and there's no cost to me if i choose to disregard it. biden sets policy and has the army behind him to enforce those policies. that's not constitutional but since when has that stopped any of them lately?
i think the ultimate question is: if you had a fantasy jail, who's in there for life and who isn't? fauci yes, ZDogg no. and sadly, as much as i would enjoy it, even sam harris hasn't done anything criminally wrong that would earn him a cell in my dream prison.
so we can disagree and enjoy this friendly banter and both come away enriched, i hope.
"people look up to doctors as authorities and the State gives them protected status as authorities on medicine." well, California is certainly taking that away and anyone who still has trust in the medical system at this point might be an irredeemable fool.
"Did you notice he used ad hominem and arguments of authority" maybe i'll find it and listen to it again.
"I think doctors like ZDogg do influence people, that is one reason they get paid." but doctors like ZDogg have had their podcasts for a long time; it's not like they cropped up just to act as propaganda arms for the US government's public health policy. they've had podcasts on various topics and had on guests that you may have found interesting. and they don't "get paid." they are paid by their listeners, some who find them interesting and entertaining enough to subscribe to get more than what is offered for free (i'm too cheap). both ZDogg and Prasad have been in the medical field for years and i'm sure that they took vaccines for granted. now if it turns out that they got funds from the government to sneak certain messages into their podcasts, as i'd bet TWIV did, that would be unforgivable and in that case, even an apology wouldn't do it for me.
i have no real problem with someone saying "i think everyone in a certain risk category should get vaccinated" as long as that's what they believed and they weren't getting paid to say it. and i have no problem with them, later as they saw more things, wondering "WTF is going on with these vaccines?" i don't think that's hypocrisy or demands a mea culpa.
i DO have a problem with a guy like Piers Morgan saying "strip them of their rights, imprison them, forcibly vaccinate them" and then later, realizing that there might be a price to pay for such behavior, trying to justify it- "well, with the information i had at the time..." and "the science has changed." that's bullshit and no apology is sufficient. this guy revealed himself as a dark soul. he would have been first in line to load jews onto boxcars. who would ever listen to him again?
"sign of illogical reasoning"
the greatest example of illogical reasoning i ever heard was on TWIV. one week they would interview peter daszak who talked about how oh so easy it was to manipulate a virus and the next week, someone would ask about the lab leak possibility and they would say "oh human beings aren't smart enough to make anything as clever as sars cv-2. i'd think huh? trust me, they're still talking about natural origin.
"I love Peter Atia BTW."
i especially loved it when Atia came around to the lab leak hypothesis in his interview with katherine eban. (do you remember Atia saying that the vaccines were great and so effective that you shouldn't have any cancer screenings after getting them? do you remember him later on saying that he would not get his children vaccinated and he moved his family to texas? but i have yet to hear him apologize for saying that the vaccines were great. i wonder if he's having a bit of buyer's remorse. he took a position- for himself- based on his medical training and later on, he saw that something was fishy and adjusted accordingly).
i am especially disappointed in eric topol. that's who i can't forgive. in his podcast with atia, he talked about how he was tortured, fired, threatened (by MERCK) after pointing out the safety signal for VIOXX. atia thought it was a good drug that was unjustly taken off the market but topol made him see it differently since he had lived through it.
then i heard that very same topol (who i respected and bought his book) accusing bret weinstein of spreading "dangerous misinformation" that is "killing people" with that insufferable and unbearable sam harris.
as if death threats only matter when they happen to you, dr. topol but they're fine for everyone else, provided you don't like them.
then harris said on triggernometry that it didn't matter if hunter biden's laptop contained photos of dead children in the basement, it needed to be kept hidden because keeping trump out of office justified anything!!! YIKES!!!!!
i expect ZDogg might admit that he got some things wrong one of these days and it's ok to be wrong as long as you didn't threaten to fire or kill people who didn't think you were right. but there's something oddly communist about making people recant their past sins. as for topol and harris, they can apologize till the cows come home. they're dead to me. which doesn't mean that they might not say something intelligent that i can agree with one of these days. but as examples of humanity, no way.
"maintain critical thinking skills"
i still think people have to take some responsibility. just as i can't respect women who blame the "patriarchy," BLM blaming systemic racism or ancestral slavery or any of the other career victims blaming someone or something else for their failures, i can't blame guys like ZDogg and Prasad who i didn't hear pressure anyone to do anything. now, like i said, i haven't heard much ZDogg and i mostly read Prasad so maybe they did urge people to get vaccinated. i would expect them to do that, steeped as they are in conventional medicine (much like aseem malhotra who never questioned vaccines in general and covid vaccines specifically until his father died. we're not going to ask him to apologize, are we? isn't losing his father enough? do we really want to call him a shill for the drug companies- even though he did urge people to get vaccinated- when he's probably getting plenty of heat from those same companies and his wikipedia page will be rewritten to tar him as a "spreader of dangerous misinformation" and he's certainly jeopardized his career?) but there's a big difference between urging without teeth and coercive urging at gunpoint. whatever you think, they're just talking. a lot of people tried to blame joe rogan for all vaccine hesitancy but really, he's just a guy talking. and he was 9 when i decided against flu shots so i don't think he had that much to do with it.
we all listened to biden warn us about the winter of severe illness and death. some of us marched right out and got vaccinated. some of us threw our shoes at the television set. some of us (me) used it as a christmas card. ZDogg can give his opinion and there's no cost to me if i choose to disregard it. biden sets policy and has the army behind him to enforce those policies. that's not constitutional but since when has that stopped any of them lately?
i think the ultimate question is: if you had a fantasy jail, who's in there for life and who isn't? fauci yes, ZDogg no. and sadly, as much as i would enjoy it, even sam harris hasn't done anything criminally wrong that would earn him a cell in my dream prison.
so we can disagree and enjoy this friendly banter and both come away enriched, i hope.